76 thoughts on “what are you really paying for?”

1. Indeed, its the ‘finding’ thats the hard part, eh? 🙂 Shyness, fear, rejection….a vicious circle in the making.

   It brings me back to the original topic – money for time – and it really reinforces it. The time I have spent with escorts has been really valuable in both a sexual experience realm, as well as the psychological.

   From a sexual perspective, I have received both sincere advice (and practical experience) from my ladies on what to do, what not to do…how to do it…the whole gamut. Hey, to a guy who doesn’t *have* such experience…how does one expect us to acquire the advice and guidance of the very sex we are trying to please, eh?

   And from a psychological perspective, the time spent ‘pillow-talking’ on subjects that I would otherwise just keep to myself is by itself worth the price of admission. To say nothing of the little incremental increases in my own self-confidence. I am still a ways from ‘being there’, but I can certainly say that there is a spring in my step for days after a visit….and yes, that confidence has manifested itself in conversations with ladies with whom I would otherwise not have had the guts to speak to.

   A cliche, I suppose, but the escorts I have been with have been the best therapists I have ever been with. Maybe I’m just lucky, but thats the reality for me. 🙂

2. Juan,

   We are therapists. No doubt about it. 🙂

   XX

3. Hi Juan,

   I’m glad you understand! I don’t generally set out to find alpha males, at least not the stereotypical ones. But I’ve found that I simply cannot be in a relationship where my extremely geeky proclivities are seen as something “weird”. The Shy Guys you described, such as yourself, I know of and yet I’ve never seen that misogynistic “Nice Guy” streak in them. My “brother” Ricardo was like that but he was never, ever an asshole but he eventually found the woman of his dreams who he married and has a 2-year-old daughter with via their shared geekitude.

   I can be shy in some situations but I’ve gotten over that to an extent as Amanda can attest to. I’ve become maternal almost in my approach to people, especially in large groups, and I introduce myself, especially to someone who looks as though they feel out of place and I want to make sure they’re comfortable and having a good time. Most of the time, now that I think about it, the only situations in which I can be described as reserved is when I’m around people who I think will be easily offended by my non-normative views on almost everything!

   And I always put sex first! 🙂

   It was great talking to you, Juan.

4. “…shared geekitude…”

   Heehee, I’m getting rather on in years…but you should have seen how hard it was to ‘share ones geekitude’ with other like-minded folks back when I was a kid. Say, the late 70’s/early 80’s. With the rise of the Computer, at least those who exhibit geeky proclivities have increased in direct proportion. The odds just keep getting better! 🙂

   “… I introduce myself, especially to someone who looks as though they feel out of place and I want to make sure they’re comfortable and having a good time…”

   Now thats good to hear – Good on you!

   I try and do the same thing when I can – its a pleasure to find someone at the fringes of an event with the “oh gawd why am I here, I should just go home!” look on their face…and then to draw them out and see if a smile can be placed there instead. 😉

   Oddly enough, my shyness only really manifests itself with ladies…or more specifically ladies I am attracted to. I do large-group seminars for work, and am often out at functions, cocktail parties, and the like…and I doubt that anyone would think I had such a problem with shyness. If I’m not in love, or love-interested, I can be a pretty gregarious guy.

   Talk about your Curse of Sisyphus.

5. I’m sorry I hadn’t spotted this post before. My views are not totally allied to yours here and I think I need to compose a detailed response so, with your permission, I will post a response on my blog referencing yours

   To cut to the chase though; no-one should do a job that they don’t enjoy. Different people doing the same job may get job satsfaction in different ways. For you I suspect this means being respected and valued as a person and not just a sex object. I also suspect you would be happy in your job if you were dealing with a client that didn’t treat you in this way. In some cases that type of client may feel that he is also making a positive contribution to the time you spend together

   As long as he feels that he has bought an experience that provides him with value, you feel that you have been properly compensated for the experience that you have provide, and you both feel that the shared experience met mutual expectations, then both parties are happy. It doesn’t matter one iota that the part of the experience that he feels he has paid for is not the same as the part of the experience you feel deserves compensation

   … and I hope I haven’t just lost a friend

6. Sorry, the”would” in the second para should, of course, be “wouldn’t”

   oops

7. Jek,

   You’re totally right. As long as both parties feel satisfied with what occured, then it was good.

   What this post was talking about were men who tried to take without giving. If I’m hanging with my friends, then I’m taking/giving equally (I hope — we all have moments where it’s more one or the other). When I’m with someone who not only isn’t giving as I need but is taking as well — then there’s no point in being in their company.

   For the record, it doesn’t matter to me if a guy thinks he’s paying for the freedom to suck my left toe. As far as I’m concerned, he’s still paying for my time/energy because that’s what I’m giving (and rights to my left toe). If I took away my time/energy and only gave him access to my left toe, he’d feel cheated. Clients pay for my time/energy — whether they’re fully aware of this or not.

   XX

   PS: No, you haven’t lost a friend 🙂

8. Amanda,
   I need help understanding something – why do men think it is okay to see an escort who is 50 years younger? Using an escort is one thing but using on that is so much younger concerns me. What do 20-something escorts REALLY think about having sex (or the man may try to have sex) with someone that much older? I’m sorry but a 70+ man having sex with a 22-year old almost seems like a form of ‘pay to rape’ to me. I’m not against age-appropriate escorts. A guy I’m considering getting involved with does use girls, literally, 50 years younger. He lies about it to me. I’m very concerned and really need advice,
   thanks,
   edna

9. Edna,

   You asked two questions in there: “why do men think” it’s OK, and “what do 20-something escorts really think” about it.

   I can’t answer the second question, but I am a guy who’s (ah) getting up in years. So maybe I can help with your first one. Disclaimer: I’m “a” guy, not *your* guy. *shrug* Maybe he and I think completely differently about things. But here are a few of my thoughts:

   #1: IMHO, his lying about this is a Bad Thing and a Bad Sign. In the long term, honesty is better even if one of you doesn’t t like the message.

   #2: Regarding the “age” matter:

   I’m not in my 70s — yet. But — for me — the thing that usually disqualifies barely-legal girls is their conversation. From my perspective, they usually haven’t lived very long or thought about very much, so they usually have little to say that interests me.

   That might be good-enough for a 5-minute quickie (with price to match), but it is certainly not what I would expect of an escort of Amanda’s calibre.

   That said, if she’s in her 20s, with the liveliness and energy of a 20-something, and if she is also mature enough in mind and heart to hold up her end of a pleasant evening *before* going behind the bedroom doors — someone like Amanda, or like some of the other ladies who have posted here– then why not?

   Perhaps this feels a little threatening. After all, this man is someone you said you are thinking of getting involved with. Might he prefer these young girls to you?

   If “involved” means, potentially, years of domestic bliss — spending those years together could be a very different thing from having a pleasant evening like that. For example:

   My wife and I will be celebrating our 20thy anniversary in a few months. We married when I was 40 and she was 31. (Life begins at 40!) That’s close enough, given where we were/are in age, that we’ve had *enough* shared cultural history (as well as our shared interests and so forth) to help us continue to communicate over months and years of constant contact.

   Am I likely to have that kind of connection with someone in her early 20s? Nope, and that’s why I probably wouldn’t marry one. But a pleasant evening? With a consenting adult?

   If we assume (for the sake of this discussion) that doing this would not hurt my wife– from my (a guy’s) point of view, why not?

   The real question is, why would *she* want to try to have a pleasant evening with a dried-out old guy? 🙂

   And that question, of course, I’m *not* equipped to answer. 😀

10. Edna,

    I’m not really sure why it matters. He’s paying for a lot of things — a big one is the fantasy aspect. If the 20yr old escort is happy with her job and the arrangement she makes with him — why does it concern you?

    Youth is beauty. Youth isn’t always brains, heart or anything else. There’s nothing wrong with paying for beauty. That’s why I enjoy art museums instead of trying to draw in my sketchbook.

    If you wonder whether or not she gets sexual pleasure from him — if he’s good in bed and they have chemistry — yes, it’s entirely possible. If you’re wondering if his worn exterior turns her on as her beauty does him — probably not.

    RSRD,

    Good point about his honesty or lack of it! THAT’S the biggie! Not the age gap or the “what do they do in bed?” thing.

    His expectations for his real partners is also an issue. Can he separate his fantasy play-time from his real life?

    XX

11. Amanda,

    “Expectations” — yes, another good one.

    Will our unnamed Old Guy expect Edna to (1) behave and/or (2) look like these younger ladies? (I think that’s where you’re going with the “separate his fantasy play-time from his real life” thing — by all means, correct me if I’m wrong.)

    Here’s another one: Will he expect Edna to let him continue to play with these younger ladies, after they become “involved”?

    But also from the other direction:

    Edna, if you do decide to get involved with this guy, would you expect him to stop playing with them (and, perhaps, with any other ladies)?

    Are you thinking, perhaps, “He’d be wonderful if it weren’t for what he’s doing with those young chickies. Are they giving him something I wouldn’t be able to give him — or can I be so engaging that he’ll stop going to them?”

    All these are choices that you and he are free to make; I’m not going to be negative on any of them. However I would encourage you to see him as he is, right now — not as he might be, if he would let you mold his clay into the shape you like.

    Because he might not let you. Especially if he’s in his 70s — his character and personality are probably pretty-well established, by now. He might be beyond the point where he might be a lady’s fixer-upper project. He might be a package deal. And you may have to decide whether the “bad parts” of the package outweigh its “good parts.”

    Just sayin’.

12. RSRD,

    You hit it. Yes, what are Old Guy’s and Edna’s expectations of each other? Only they can answer that, hopefully honestly.

    It’s one thing to offer an idea to try and open someone’s mind. It’s quite another to try and “change” someone. People change to suit themselves — no one else (if they ever do change).

    XX

13. Anyone seen the Seinfeld episode where Jerry is dating a masseuse? He’s dying to get a massage from her, especially the day when she brings her table to his place after work. But she does this for a living and is not interested in giving it away for free, even to a boyfriend…

    Amanda, in that last line of your entry, I do see a thread: men equate money with sex when in the company of women. They just think that if every time they want sex it will cost them (one way or another, and it just does)… it should follow that no request for sex will cause no request for money.
    They’re wrong, of course, as a gentleman knows that:
    1. A lady is always right, and…
    2. A gentleman always pays
    🙂

    Let me ask you then: when a provider asks ME out, should I still pay? My answer to this is YES. See #2. Like freebie offers, I take that as the compliment that they are and politely insist on reaching for my wallet. 😉

    Things get easier when one realizes that sex is ALWAYS on a man’s mind, and COMPENSATION on a woman’s. I’m not sure who is entitled in all of this…

    Don’t actors often have flings with each other on set, and end up parting ways after the shoot? They are professionals who pretend for a living and sell fantasy, and YET they still get confused and act on fake feelings.
    I think its very human and a risk of sex work to have people lose perspective after a good time and forget that EVERY interaction is strictly professional.
    I have to keep remembering that, like a cop or a priest, a sex worker is never off the clock.

    And that was Alfred Camus who gave this great definition of charm that you used, Amanda. I think about it a lot and do my best to keep things unsaid with women (especially pros, that I never question) because of it, and… it’s not always easy for a man. 😉

14. Hobbyist,

    Good reply…except when it comes to wanting a relationship. There the “compensation” should be an equal exchange of emotion/respect. It’s hard to find. Even harder when starting out at the provider/client point. Things get murky fast.

    Girls have it hard in this situation too. They never want to offend, they don’t want their bills to be unpaid, they don’t want to be hurt or taken advantage of. I see these issues a lot. It’s tough waters to navigate because we also question the reality of our feelings for a client.

    None of it is pretty or easy. However…men do sometimes bring things on themselves when assuming WAY too much on something that wasn’t offered in the first place. What this post was about.

    XX

15. I hear you on the “exchange” thing. I was simplifying for clarity, but I think that although men and women come from different places, they hope to meet half-way (where they can share a mutually-satisfying exchange).
    I also think that the balance is hard to maintain, if it was there to begin with, and it’s why most types of relationships eventually crumble. One party always ends up putting in more than the other and getting the short end of the stick.

    But that’s beyond the scope of your post, as you said. I discussed peripheral stuff because your main point was bothering me, but I felt as dense as Robert and didn’t see what I could contribute.
    I’ve ranted myself about folks walking up to me and expecting free coaching (I’m moderately successful in a profession with many applicants and few working people). So I do know where the frustration comes from. I share advice liberally and in controlled venues (like industry boards), but refuse to be at the mercy of anyone who requires guidance, and have hurt a few feelings that way.

    But for a man, it IS a hurdle to understand why a social drink with a woman (even if she does market social companionship) cannot be separated from work.

    After giving it some thought, I think I get it, however. Escorts are entertainers. And I’ve seen first hand how entertainers can be the constant targets of harrassment. Because people confuse private person with public persona and clearly violate their idol’s boundaries by acting like fans. Fans somehow think they “own” an artist they love because they paid for a few shows… and we all know they really don’t. I think it’s a form of entitlement, as the point has been raised here before.

    So some entertainers are more or less gracious all around, others real jerks in private, but they ALL feel the burden of fame and prefer to be left alone UNLESS they have invited the attention, like while performing.

    Regardless of this understanding, I know that it’s always been a let-down for me to witness a Mr. Nice Guy on screen or stage tell people to fuck off. They break “character” and I never see them the same way. The public, like many men in presence of women, can be like kids – demanding and annoying, but their bad manners are kinda… innocent.

    For an escort, I think that a patient explanation is the best response to unwanted offers and attention. If they don’t get it they can then go to hell. lol
    But then, I’m not an escort.

    For the record, I’m not speaking from experience but solidarity with my less perceptive fellow hobbyists.
    I’ve been in a few confusing situations with providers, usually when they said something or made an offer that took me aback, and have always reverted to “it’s business” as a defense mechanism. I certainly didn’t want a suddenly enlarged… ego to put me in a position to be rejected.
    As you know we do have fragile egos (the armor is on the outside)… 🙂

    I also hear you on the girls having a rough deal. I’ve seen them struggle not to ask burning questions (providers know about boundaries) or with the fear of being rejected because of what they do (most live with the stigma). But we were talking about what men are paying for, not what women are selling, eh?

16. Hobbyist,

    Patient explanations often lead to insulted or hurt feelings no matter what. Men take these things personally when they shouldn’t be in this grey area to begin with. It’s ALWAYS a mess.

    This post is about men NOT wanting to pay for what they should pay for. It IS about what we’re selling, which is our time/energy. This is the thing so many men don’t seem to think they need to pay for, hence where all the tension comes into play.

    My take on this is: you pay for my time/energy, the sex is free.

    XX

17. Can’t believe I called Albert “Alfred” (Thanks for pretending not to notice)!

18. You really brought the crazies out of the woodwork with this post. I couldn’t read through them because they quickly became tiresome, but I think I got the gist of it. You get paid to spend time with people. Some people ask you to do it for free, which is not cool. Asking a massage therapist to lunch is not the same because they are selling massages, not their company. Asking a massage therapist for a free massage would be akin to asking an escort for free companionship. If you had a private nurse for a sick family member, and called her up on her day off to ask if she’d stop by for a few minutes while you ran errands, what do you think her reaction would be? “Yes, of course, let me put my own plans aside so I can go do my job for free. It’s only a short while.” Not on your life. She’d remind you it’s her day off and that you need to pay her. People are capable of understanding when something is being asked for without compensation. Understanding isn’t jumping to conclusions. Next. Women who want to be paid to do their job are angry, man hating lesbians? And because some people develop open source software, or volunteer, escorts should have sex with ugly poor men because it is as essential to survival as food and shelter? I couldn’t read more than that, all logic was gone by then. I think some people drink too much before they comment.

19. Also, the repetitive comments about men not understanding, or the line being blurred for them, etc. Fine, perhaps this is true, but isn’t that the point of making a post to say there are no free lunches? It has been posted so now there can be no more misunderstanding.

20. Anna — Smackdown! So well said. Thank you.

21. When I was a corporate executive, I was often asked for coffee so someone could pick my brain. I was a single parent, and asked them if they would come over on the weekend to my home, where I would make coffee with my kidderoo. No takers.

    This week I was approached by a C suite executive to go for coffee as an escort. He wanted to get to know me, so he could see me in my condo (he hates hotels).

    You know where this goes – he would then want to sample the goods “just to be sure”.

    This added new meaning to invasiveness. He thought it was funny that I wanted $300 for java. Cock-roach, indeed!

    The only way to establish worth is to have a price on it. I am open 13 hours a day, and every one of those days I pay for something, and I have upkeep, and administration. I am also a volunteer and a blood donor.

    Bring me something more than coffee and your needs.

    1. Ann — I’m actually amazed that no one took you up on your offer when you were in the corporate world, unless the point was that they wanted to do something more than pick your brains. (If I want to pick someone’s brains, I’m very open to what makes them comfortable since they’re doing ME a favor.)

       I hate it when guys want to invade your personal space for no real reason (men on sugardaddy sites were the worst). And then, they think that escorts don’t have to pay rent with money — they think we pay it in wine and meals, apparently. Though the “goods sampling” is a bit much. What, did he think he was casting a movie or something??? Your website is all the sampling he’s going to get. Ugh.

       “The only way to establish worth is to have a price on it. ” Yes, this. And this: “Bring me something more than coffee and your needs.” Because what do YOU get out of that, other than caffeine that you can get for yourself?

22. One more thought – an overdue one.

    Amanda Brooks has always been very generous with her time. Why, look at the size of this thread! Her comments and advice have always been the gold standard in this business, and she has helped thousands, myself included. She has been very liberal with sharing her experience and opinions in her blogs and segments from her books. She is truly committed to helping others and has proven it over and over. Simply put, she has made it a safer, more professional, and more loving environment.

    BIG FAT SLOPPY AIR KISS for all of your help and loving commitment. You earn the right to leadership every day.

    Cheers,

    Ann

    1. Ann — Thank you for the compliments, and for pointing out the obvious: I give away a heck of a lot of my time for free and without demanding anything in return. Though usually that time isn’t given away to men who “just want to meet for coffee.”

       Sloppy air kisses right back atchta! 🙂

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